swan_tower: (*writing)
[personal profile] swan_tower

Brainstorming time!

I’d like you all to tell me what objects you might, from a mythical standpoint, associate with the delineation of boundaries and borders. I’m looking specifically for objects that might be a personal possession; walls and fences are obvious boundary markers, as are rivers, but neither are really the sort of thing a person could carry around with them. A sword, on the other hand, being a thing that cuts, could be the thing that marks the division between Here and Not Here, whether by literally drawing a line in the dirt or just symbolically cleaving things apart.

Can you think of/make an argument for other personal-sized objects that might represent geographical boundaries?

Originally published at Swan Tower. You can comment here or there.

Date: 2016-10-28 01:18 am (UTC)
alexseanchai: Katsuki Yuuri wearing a blue jacket and his glasses and holding a poodle, in front of the asexual pride flag with a rainbow heart inset. (Default)
From: [personal profile] alexseanchai
Writing implement, to inscribe the boundary?

Date: 2016-10-28 02:26 am (UTC)
rosefox: Me looking out a window, pensive. (thoughtful)
From: [personal profile] rosefox
An umbrella or jacket or tent or other similar gear that draws a boundary between the environment and the self. Look at the trope of swirling one's cloak around oneself as part of disappearance magic, for example.

A souvenir from a border crossing (like a keychain from an airport kiosk, or dirt from a crossroads) that carries the memory of that border.

A key or ring of keys. Maybe too obvious!

The opposite of the sword might be a needle and thread, to bring Here and Not Here close enough that the border can be crossed.

Date: 2016-10-28 04:17 pm (UTC)
via_ostiense: Eun Chan eating, yellow background (Default)
From: [personal profile] via_ostiense
Thread, rock (which can be made into, or taken from, a cairn or wall).

Date: 2016-10-28 01:30 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] aishabintjamil.livejournal.com
A string or cord could be used to lay out a perimeter or boundary. It carries nicely in a pocket.

Date: 2016-10-28 01:42 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] mindstalk.livejournal.com
Belt? Me and Not-Me. Instant magic circle if laid on the ground.

Date: 2016-10-28 02:44 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] bloodstones.livejournal.com
A stone from or symbolizing a cairn.

Date: 2016-10-28 03:33 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] anna-wing.livejournal.com
A small map of the relevant territory as you wish it to be.

Using the concept that a dividing line has two sides:

Two pebbles, one from each side of the line you wish to draw.

A piece of cloth bearing a reflecting design (the yin-yang is one example) or a transforming design (like some of Escher's). A small disc of glass or polished metal could also have the same symbolic connotation.

Date: 2016-10-28 03:59 am (UTC)
sovay: (I Claudius)
From: [personal profile] sovay
Can you think of/make an argument for other personal-sized objects that might represent geographical boundaries?

Keys. They open doors, which stand between one place and another.

Date: 2016-10-28 04:35 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] tiger-spot.livejournal.com
Rope. Possibly a tent or ground cloth, for an inside/outside sort of boundary. A few pebbles, to lay out in a line. A telescope, or surveying equipment, to look out along the boundaries?

Date: 2016-10-28 06:27 am (UTC)
edenfalling: stylized black-and-white line art of a sunset over water (Default)
From: [personal profile] edenfalling
Visa stamps in a passport.

A watch is a delineating mechanism, though it separates chunks of time rather than space.

A mirror.

Date: 2016-10-28 09:11 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] martianmooncrab.livejournal.com
I carry a tape measure with me.

Date: 2016-10-28 01:20 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ashnistrike.livejournal.com
Chalk, or something else you could use to literally draw the line.

Date: 2016-10-28 02:37 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] apel.livejournal.com
Salt can be used to define a boundary. Use enough of it and it will kill the vegetation under it, so the mark will be more permanent.

Weed torch. Similar to salt, it will kill grass and weeds to define a boundary.

Date: 2016-10-28 02:45 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] tiger-spot.livejournal.com
Rope. Possibly a tent or ground cloth, for an inside/outside sort of boundary. A few pebbles, to lay out in a line. A telescope, or surveying equipment, to look out along the boundaries?

Date: 2016-10-28 03:10 pm (UTC)
siduri1959: (Default)
From: [personal profile] siduri1959
Brick dust.

Date: 2016-10-28 03:28 pm (UTC)
From: [personal profile] aryllian
Candles?

Maybe not so much geographic, but I feel like candles are frequently part of the kind of circle that's meant to summon stuff and keep it inside the circle. I feel like there's a division between light and darkness implicit in candles too, and if you mess with the composition of the candles, you could make other distinctions with them perhaps... i.e. bees wax from a certain bee hive in a certain location, mixing other location-related stuff into the wax of the candle... dipping the wick into a certain river and then letting it dry, but the mystical connection could be said to remain...

Date: 2016-10-28 04:53 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] tortoise.livejournal.com
A copy of Richard Dedekind's essay "Continuity and Irrational Numbers," which defines real numbers as boundary points between sets of rational numbers.

Something associated with a specific border/boundary (a piece of the Berlin Wall; a postcard from the Grand Canyon or Niagara Falls).

A sheepdog enforces the boundary between "the flock" and "not the flock." Bonus points if it's a Border Collie.

Date: 2016-10-29 01:39 am (UTC)
marycatelli: (Default)
From: [personal profile] marycatelli
A watch. A stopped watch set to a liminal time such as midnight. (Sunset or sunrise would be too variable.) Probably a pocket watch so you could swing it by its chain.

A compass (as in straight-line and compass, not the directional one.

Date: 2016-10-29 03:05 am (UTC)
ext_17983: Photo of an orange tabby curled up and half asleep (Writing)
From: [identity profile] juushika.livejournal.com
Adder stones (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adder_stone) of any size. Rings perhaps could share the same function. But I suppose they're more symbols of views into, rather than journeys into, other realms; maybe not what you're looking for.

A lot of mythic containers (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mythological_objects#Containers) are personal possession-sized and bridge this plane with other planes, although maybe not via geography.

All of the above suggestions are fantastic.

Date: 2016-10-29 05:22 am (UTC)
brooksmoses: (Default)
From: [personal profile] brooksmoses
There are also things like survey markers, though to properly make a boundary with them you'd want a pair. Or three, to bound an area.

And see also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boundary_marker, for ones that aren't quite the same as survey markers.

Date: 2016-10-29 01:57 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] xahra99.livejournal.com
A flag, or a rope of small flags. Cairns. Small inuksuks or lintel stones-you could carry the stones with you. Twisted willow. A square of mown grass-you could carry small shears.A wreath. Fire. Ashes. Stakes. A ridge of earth (you could carry a shovel). A hide cut into strips (http://www.indigogroup.co.uk/edge/Oxhide1.htm) Pieces of bread. A path of flower petals. A daisy chain. Ribbons. Paper chains. Sterile boundaries in my profession are marked with pieces of tape or colour codes. Buoys on water.A portable animal, plant or fruit (hares were introduced to Britain during the Roman era, as were olives)...
Edited Date: 2016-10-29 01:58 pm (UTC)

Date: 2016-10-29 03:56 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] klwilliams.livejournal.com
Is this general or personal? Something from your bedroom used to mark "your stuff" from "their stuff". A blade of grass to mark the boundary of your yard. (Mac is aware of this boundary.)

Date: 2016-10-30 12:49 am (UTC)
From: (Anonymous)
A handle from a window or a door. A stone from the edge between land and sea. A border guard's uniform. A stick from a wood hedge.
A mirror. A key (could also score marks in soft materials). I liked somebody elses idea of a clock stopped to midnight. A map or a perambulation (written down) or a deed of sale of a bit of land.
Taxidermied lips from some animal - the boundary between within and without the body. Any animal skin is the same boundary, but the mouth is where most crossings happen.
Grave dirt for life and death boundary, or cremation ashes or something else depending on funerary customs. A death certificate?
A rope that somebody has been hanged with, which can also be put down to mark a boundary.
A whip to break the sound barrier with.
A document freeing somebody from slavery. (Part of) the ransom for a hostage.
Baptismal water or a paper with the baptizing ritual as part of the boundary between "heathen" and christened states. (That's very Christianity-specific, but might have parallells in the culture you write about. Also, I think the water in the baptizing is theologically unremarkable in my denomination and only required to be clean, but if people understand the symbol it still symbolises even if it isn't meant to.)
Placenta or amniotic sac (or pieces thereof) for the boundary between offspring and bearer. Eggshell, both bird/world and embryo/chick boundaries.
Things from temporal turningpoints: New Years champagne, a turnip lantern from Samhain, the first or last harvested from the year, the first snow (melted or kept magically frosen in a flask), a cow's first calf.
A wedding band. A degree diploma. Some piece of clothing only for a specific age like short pants and long trousers used to be. A wood carving that is both a girl with braids and a woman with her hair up (change attributes to fit culture).
Milk teeth would be both a mouth boundary and a growing up boundary.
A cage. A thermos flask (I mean, that would have to be established because I'm throwing ideas out wildly but it shouln't be impossible with the keeping the hot insides different from the cold outside). A condom. A door lintel.
An actual electrical fence ought to be possible to carry (bundled up, and maybe excepting the battery/generator/whatever).

Date: 2016-10-30 12:50 am (UTC)
From: [personal profile] vcmw
Thread, or ink, either of which could be used to make maps or create lines. Strands of hair, individual or woven into ropes or twisted.

Date: 2016-10-30 09:11 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] houseboatonstyx.livejournal.com
I got a visual flash which doesn't make much sense, but here it is. Something about the size and shape of the Olympic torch, but smaller and simpler. Its light goes out in all directions, horizontal only. Imagine the ruddy horizontal light of the setting sun, which strikes only the top slopes of mountains, or castles, or masts, or trees. Or birds that fly through its beams. Holding it, you are the center of its circle. So all the lit areas somehow belong to you.

Date: 2016-10-30 06:01 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] diatryma.livejournal.com
A pen, laid on a table, marks my territory vs someone else's. Lights, if you have the infrastructure. Chairs in a circle or something like that, the way an outdoor wedding is separated from the rest of the park.

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